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Electric Tankless Water Heaters

tankless_water_heater_siebel.jpg

Note: This post has been expanded and updated for 2009!

Tankless water heaters only heat water when it is needed. About 8% to 30% of the energy consumed by a standard water heater goes to keeping the water hot while it’s not being used. New tankless systems heat the water instantly when you turn on the faucet, rather than keeping a tank full of hot water 24/7 whether you’re using it or not. Tankless heaters run on either electricity or gas, just like regular heaters. They start out at about $300 for electric and $600 for gas.

There are two main brands of whole-house electric tankless water heaters: Stiebel Eltron and Powerstar. They come in various models, which are rated on the “gallons per minute” that they deliver.

The online store Low Energy Systems has a good selection of tankless water heaters, both electric and gas-powered. You can also find tankless water heaters reviewed on Amazon–this is one of the few places you’ll find reviews from owners themselves.

See more information about water heaters and electrical savings at Ask Mr. Electricity

Comments 153

  1. On 09-08-09 I purchased a Hubbell water heater model number 220-3. On this date 03-04-10 I have decided to write a reveiw. I intentionally waited 6 months to do this so the heater was used from September thru February when the incoming water temp would be the lowest in my area which is near Ft. Worth, Texas. I had a SETS model 220 that never operated to my satisfaction. This Hubbell unit is fantastic. It supplies a constant supply of hot water. In the warmer months I set the heater at 105 degrees and that was the temperature I got although in the colder months the outgoing water temperature dropped to 103 degrees which was hardly enough to be noticed. No big deal as I could have just readjusted the temperature on the panel to 107 degrees but in my case I never did as 103 was very comfortable for showers.

    I am completely satisfied with the Hubbell unit.

    Jim H.

    North Central Texas

  2. I am just trying to find out is there a saving in the electric payments in tankless verses a tank. Is there a savings. Is it worth the cost to change to tankless?

    1. Jimmy,
      We are sorry to hear that your having problems with you SET’s heater. Hubbell did purchase the asset’s of SET’s and we are here to help you troubleshoot any problems your having. You can call me directly if you choose to. 877-649-8589 x136.

  3. So I purchased an Ecosmart ECO-18 tankless water heater this summer and it worked great for about 2 months. Now it is just sparatic in the heating department. It heats wonderfully in the shower for a while then it scalds you and within a few seconds freezes you. This continues for multiple rounds until it finally levels out. It doesn’t do it all of the time just every third or fourth shower it seems. I has also been know to not heat at all on occasions even though it shows it is getting power. Don’t know why but I have contacted the company and am waiting to see what they have to say about it. I will post a response once I see what they say.

    1. So I have contacted the company several times and here is what they have to say about the problem:
      Hello Mr. Baiter
      I think the problem might be that the unit is at 140. I want to go over the reset procedures
      1. Turn on a shower or tub
      2. With the water running turn of the power to the unit
      3. Wait about 1 minute so the unit gets cold
      4. Turn on power while the water is running
      5. Set unit to 110
      6. Leave unit at 110 and try it out
      7. Let me know how it worked out

      That was the third contact with them. Here was the one before that:
      Hello Mr. Baiter
      I will be more than happy to help you. I called the number you provided but there was no voice mail for me to leave a message.
      I have a few questions.
      What temperature is the unit set at?
      Are you on well water or city water?
      Please give me a call or send me an email so I can help you resolve this situation.
      Thank You,
      Carlos Cabrera Jr.
      Vice President
      Corporate Accounts
      3315 N.W. 167th St
      Miami Gardens, FL 33056
      Toll Free: (877) 474-6473 Ext 203
      Direct: 305-623-7900
      Fax: 305-623-7923
      Jr@ecosmartus.com
      http://www.ecosmartus.com

      I have been happy with the quick response that has been provided with the company but the issues they are asking about are things I feel should be provided either with the unit or before you purchase the unit. I mean who really puts a setting for something that would make the unit not work. If you can set the heater to 140, it should work at 140.

      On another note, the unit is still not working properly and I am waiting to hear back from the company to see what to do next…

      1. Did you get it resolved? I’m emailing back and forth with this same guy before buying one of their units.

        1. I never did get it resolved but I have found ways to work around the unit. For some reason it works great in one shower but for the tubs, it will only work when the flow of water is very low. I don’t know what causes it but for the price I have invested in getting the unit and the install prices, I figured it was either find a way or just loose the money. I finally gave up on waiting for the company to help.

  4. S Clark, it appears you have an interest in Hubble. Can you confirm the previous owner of SETS was Carlos Cabrera, sold to Hubble, and that he opened a company called American Tankless with tankless hot water hearters including a lifetime warranty, now no longer in buisness, and that the same man, Carlos Cabrera, with felon Silvio Cordeso, opened up a third company selling Ecosmart water heaters with another lifetime warranty? I am a consumer looking to buy a tankless water heater for the first time, and i dont wish to get dupped. The this seems to be the message Im getting fom this site. Thank-you.

    1. Cat:

      I believe you are correct on all accounts. Hubbell Electric Heater Company has been in business since the 1920’s, you can be assurred that we will be in business for many years to come. I welcome your call. 877-649-8589 X119

  5. To borrow an overused cliché: Don’t judge a book by its cover.
    Hubbell Electric Heater Company is a well respected manufacturer of water heaters and has been in this business for 85 years.
    Hubbell did purchase the assets from a struggling company called SETS Systems Inc. It is our intention to create a better product using existing benchmark technology and putting our touches on it. Hubbell is committed to improving a solid platform and making it better.
    However, there are unscupulous people out there selling similar technology that lack the depth and expertise that Hubbell has.
    We are committed to customer service and we do not shy away from problems. It is not our intention to fix problems that other companies have caused. If you purchase a Hubbell new or refurbished water heater we will bend over backwards to make sure you as a customer are satisfied that the product you purchased performs as we claim.
    Concerning the negative Blogs associated with our product; it always seems that bad news gets the most press. If you look at Blogs referencing the Hubbell product you will find the majority to be favorable.
    As with any product there are limitations to their use. Tankless water heaters are not always the perfect solution to every plumbing situation. Please feel free to contact us directly and we will let you know if our product will meet your needs. 877-649-8589

  6. Ryan,

    Also look at the guts of the two systems. They are the same as the SETS and all companies are based in Florida. They must all be in bed together or they would be in court fighting each other over stealing each others designs. The Hubble also shares some of the design features with some new electronics tossed in.

  7. I have installed a couple of tankless electrics. The only one worth anything is the Stiebel 60 amp version…I have installedTrinom/ Hotman about 5 years ago and it still is working(40 and 20 amp dual circuit); Installed 2 Tital SCR-2 models(60 amp) and both have failed. One with an open in one of the two heating units, the other in the control circuitry. Also had a Marey 40 amp model fail; the pressure hub eventually failed to come out all the way during water flow and activite the micro switches.

  8. My brother is a plumber in Colorado and they install many gas Rinnai tankless heaters. At this point I would not recommend an electric unit to anyone. Seems like playing russian roulette with your wallet.

    We should all email NASA and ask them to remove their support of the technology from their website as they are helping sucker us hard working people into wasting our money on the junk products their technology is in.

  9. After all the problems I had with my SETS unit, I purchased a new HUBBLE unit (240) and since it has been installed properly, have had NO PROBLEMS with it. Make sure the wires are installed securely in the sub circuit breaker. Peel the wires back, double them up if you have to and reconnect. I have a deep Kohler soaking tub that fills very nicely now. No problems.

  10. Hi everyone! I am so glad to see this posting.

    I live in Colorado, which can be cold in the winter. I have a 4 bedroom house, with two adults living in it full time, one more part time. I want a tankless water heater for many reasons. I have a jacuzzi tub which I can never fill more than 3 inches at a time with a conventional tanked gas water heater. Frustrating. Also I am having problems with the pilot light going out several times a week. In addition to this I would like to save on my utilities bill. So I am researching tankless systems.

    From what I gather, SETS had some issues, but Hubbell seems to have resolved them. I contacted a local plumber who wants $2500-$3500 to install a Rianna (spelling?) product that he says is the best. I don’t have that kind of budget…but I am afraid to take risks.

    Please….any reccommendations?

    1. Lisa:

      An electric tankless may or may not be the right choice for you. For those cold Colorado winters you will need to heat the ground water from 45 deg F to 105 deg F. The 24kW unit will provide 2.75 gpm at this temperature rise. The benefits are: effeciency, no venting, no dealing with gas or propane. The potential draw back would be providing (3)40 amp circuit breakers to power this unit. I welcome your phone call to discuss the Hubbell product. 877-649-8589

  11. As a follow-up to my previous comment, I tracked down these two URLs…

    American Heat:
    http://www.americanheatus.com/products/choosing-your-model/

    EcoSmart:
    http://www.gotanklessgogreen.com/gotanklessgogreen.html

    Check out the map. It’s the exact same graphic with the text changed within the box. Most of the stats of the models are the same too.

    I just emailed my attorney general and a consumer watchdog. I don’t want ANYONE else to fall into their lifetime warranty trap like I did. The complaint I filed with the Better Business Bureau doesn’t seem to have done anything for me.

  12. Arron, Hugo & Ranoldo,

    I am so glad I found these comments. I purchased an American Tankless Model 280 in late 2007/early 2008ish. Had a plumber install it and an electrician wire it. I have had nothing but problems with it and quickly found that American Tankless had gone out of business. So much for my lifetime warranty. The problem my unit has is that it doesn’t regulate its temperature and eventually overheats. I get maybe 5 minutes in the shower before it goes ice cold even though the unit is still on.

    I have tried everything to track these people down. Somehow, I ended up talking to people at American Heat several months ago and they wanted $150 just to honor my warranty (even though their website had the exact same unit on it with a different logo on it) and I was supposed to send them my entire unit to fix it. Screw that. I passed and have been dealing with 5 minute showers.

    Does anyone know of any legal action has been taken against these a**holes? I remember talking to Junior on the phone several times when we first installed it and he was of no help at all.

    Thanks to anyone who might be able to help me. I can’t afford to just throw this thing away and buy something else. I’m down over a thousand dollars on the purchase price and install charges.

  13. It is also pretty sad that NASA still has an endorsement on their website. That was the only reason I purchased the SETS Tankless in the first place.

  14. I purchased a SETS water heater in 2006 and it has never provided hot water flowing enough to shower. The main circut board litteraly blew up splattering solder on the ceiling above the unit. I sent it back to SETS for the lifetime warranty. It cost me $90.00 to ship it back to them and the shipping back to me. I put it back in and it worked for a day then there was a loud pop. After calling tech and telling them that I would not pay another $90.00 for it to have another round trip vacation to Florida he had me open it up. One of the heating elements had blown up which sent copper and ceramic through out our house clogging a brand new $290.00 kitchen faucet rendering it useless. The bath fixtures were easy to clean out but the kitchen faucet required buying replacement parts to fix it.

    While waiting for more parts to arrive I had to go purchase an tank water heater to install so we could bath and wash dishes in our home. Parts arrived and I changed out all the elements, circut board (2nd one) and all the sensors. The unit still does not function as advertised and now I find out that the “Lifetime” Waranty is null and void because they sold out.

    What is fishy to me is the new units being sold look the same with a few newer parts installed. They are offering 15% off to hand them back a $800 unit to get the new improved unit so they can toss a few parts on my old one and resell it again.

    The best part is that until I took mine apart to fix it I did not know that it was not even the unit I ordered. They had sent me a smaller unit than what I paid for.

    I would be very leary of purchasing a unit from them. I have sent them an email and will let you know what they come back with.

    Right now I have a $800.00 boat anchor.

    Oh and to the doubters above feel free to email me I am real and real ticked off!!
    haneshotrods@westernks.com

  15. Can anyone with a Hubbell system, please please please email me and tell me how it’s performing in their home. I had a plumber come out to install my Hubbell electric system (model 280-3) and his manager called me on vacation to talk me out of it. He said that he’s had dozens of people call to get an electric tankless taken out of their home because it doesn’t keep up with hot water demand. There was no reference to Hubbell, so I don’t know if he has experience with Hubbell. Please give me some input so I can make the best decision to use the Hubbell or order a tank water heater!

  16. I am writing to clear up some facts, SETS was purchased by a Jerry Morabito whom after only a year of ownership decided to not honor the SETS warranty, when the prior owners were in we never had a prblem as a matter of fact I have had my SETS for over 16 years. Mr. Morabito sold the company SETS to Hubbell and assigned a patent to Hubbell that he did not own. Hubbells tankless water heater is using a technology that was given to them by Mr. Morabito that never owned it, Hubbell is selling a product with a technology that is in infringement to a patent pending , and I am sure will have to face some legal issues once the company that owns the patent decides to take action. Do not be fooled , The original SETS owners and mamagement made a great product, like I said, my is over 16 years old, the silver ones. Many of my friends and relatives have the old SETS and have had no problems. Hubbell and others can only give testimonials about their units that have been in the market for under 1 year, time will tell……… There are several other tankless in the market place and when you bad mouth a competitor you should be brave enough to list your name, telephone number etc….. Otherwise it can be the competitors afraid of a superior product wrting all this crap about others. Now for example, was this written by a consumer or someone else??????

  17. In 2004 when my wife and I redid this tiny efficiency condo at the beach we decided to use the space designed for a massive tanked electric hot water heater as the space for a stacked washer/dryer combo. This meant going with a tankless hot water heater.

    Our contractor selected SETS. We lived through the same problems as described in detail above.

    After reading postings about Hubbell, I decided to try contacting Chris Zaveruha.

    WOW! What a great response! An immediate email dialogue with Chris lead to a purchase of a replacement Hubbell unit (at a very good price). It arrived in three days. It fit exactly where the comparable model SETS unit was originally installed. All wiring and connections were the same except for the new-style pipe connectors which my plumber said were much better and easier.

    It has been three weeks. We set the new Hubbell unit to 43C and totally forgot it.

    It is INVISIBLE AND TOTALLY TRANSPARENT. It works perfectly, silently, and I don’t give it a thought.

    Our space is so small we could not have a washer/dryer and a tanked hot water heater. With the Hubbell we have our washer/dryer and plenty of hot water.

    My wife just said, “Be sure and tell them that the water is always the same temperature.”

  18. I purchased and used a SETS 220-3 model for approx. 6 years enduring most of the same problems already mentioned by others. The water temperature fluctuation was probably the worst. When the circuit board malfunctioned I called for a replacement and found Hubbell had bought SETS and my lifetime guarantee was no longer in force. But the service tech I talked to was very informative (but not pushy) and offered me a nice discount to trade my SETS unit in for a Hubbell unit. After checking out other units available, their user blogs, I finally decided with the price break and the improvements the service tech described over the SETS unit I’d give Hubbell a try. Am I glad I did! So far so good. The Hubbell has fixed the fluctuation problem with a new flow meter and changed the either on or off switch to control the heating elements to a Triac switch which ramps the power to the elements, not just a shot of electricity all at once which saves me electricity and prolongs the life of the heating elements. This is great. Also the unit matched up to the plumbing, mounting, and electrical service I had with my old SETS unit without any problems easily. I am excited to see how my Hubbell 220-3 will work in the long run. I saved money on my electric bills with the SETS unit and I expect to save even more with the improvements Hubbell has made.

  19. Update on my Hubbell heater 240. THE PROBLEM IS FIXED! I hired a new electrician to install the new sub-circuit breaker. The problem was that the sheathing on the wires was preventing the wires from going completely into the circuit breaker and they were slipping out. The electrician pared off the sheathing, doubled up the wires and re-set them. All is well now. I can even fill up my soaking tub, which awaits as I write this. Thanks, Hubbell! My confidence is restored. Will have to fire that first electrician. The problem was totally on this end.

  20. Thanks, Yamil. That sounds like a good solution for the winter months. I’ll keep that in mind as I observe the problem further. e.

  21. DL: Just take some precautions, like, have your plumber install a relief valve,
    keep an eye on your flex pipe, if you will use that, to make sure the flow switch
    is turning off and the pipes are not being “cooked”. You are doing the right
    thing by finding an experienced plumber and electrician to install your heater.
    Remember that the heaters are built to last about 10 years. Best! e.

  22. Robert: I’m wondering what exactly you are refering to when you say that Hubbell is going to have patent problems? the only reference I see to a patent on thier Tankless hot water heaters (on thier website) is the flow switch: and that patent has been granted to all owners involved down the line: can be checked on the federal patent web site. Hubbell is an established water heater manufacturer, not a fly by night company just starting up, and it seems doubtful to me that they would not know what they are buying, or do thier homework on it before selling it to the public. In addition, these heaters are supposedly approved by HUD and various other government organizations.
    Elsa, thanks for your response to my inquiry: I can only use electric in my Condo (alternate energy sources not available, Propane not allowed by the Association). So I will continue my search for an electrician and a plumber that may have installed an electric tankless system somewhere in the state of RI……

  23. Robert,
    The fact is Hubbell owns the patent for a technology which utilizes a flow switch to activate a tankless heater. See the following link http://www.buytankless.com/technology.html?cat=Technology to view the patent, which clearly shows Hubbell as the current owner. In any event, Hubbell does not use this outdated technology in its heater. Hubbell redesigned and improved the way its heater operates compared to the old SETS heater (which utilized the patented technology above) and thus the Hubbell heater has, among other significant improvements, eliminated the common complaint of intemittent hot/cold water associated with the SETS heater . In any case, Hubbell has no interest in getting involved in a discussion in this forum that has no basis of truth and is not helpful to a consumer’s desire for knowledge and other users experience regarding electric tankless water heating.

  24. Elsa, Thank you for the feedback on your Hubbell heater, and I am glad to hear from yet another user that it significantly out performs the old SETS unit. I encourage you to call Hubbell’s technical service department to further discuss your problem and resolve the operational problem you are experiencing. It certainly is possible that the circuit breaker is the problem, and if that is the case my thought is when the heater needs to output 100% power (and hence full amps) to meet demand the circuit breaker is not holding. The temperature of the incoming cold water is not related to the circuit breaker tripping, other than as I mention above if 100% power is needed (which may only be when the incoming water is at its coldest) the circuit breaker is not able to handle the full load amps. I assume that the wire size and circuit breaker is sized properly according to our manual, but you may want to double check this. Regarding staggering your showers, this may in fact be necessary given the flow rate and temperature rise you are looking for, and if your demand exceeds the rating of the heater the only solution is to increase the kw (power) of the heater. I invite you to download the new Hubbell brochure and Operating manual from our website which provides detailed information on sizing. Making sure that the heater is properly sized for your needs is an important (if not the most important) aspect of trouble shooting. In any case, please call us toll free 877-649-8589 and speak to our Technical Support Department to get this matter resolved. It is important to us that we do our best to make sure that our customers are fully satisfied with the Hubbell heater, and I ask that you give us the opportunity to resolve this problem and demonstrate to you and others why Hubbell is well on the way to becoming the leader in the electric tankless water heater industry.

  25. Elsa,

    Couple things you can do (if you want) to increase the performance of your system, is to “chain” or connect more than one unit. The 1st unit warms up the water, and the 2nd heats the already warmed water even further. In order to do this you will most likely need to upgrade the electrical service to your home in order for this to work.

    Additionally, you can install point of service units for the washer, sink in kitchen, etc.

    Yamil

  26. Dear DL.
    If you have read my comments in this site, you will know the problems I have had with the SETS electric system. Well, I replaced the SETS with a brand new Hubbell tank and most of the problems have been corrected, however, my latest problem with the Hubbell is that the thermostats are kicking off the circuit breaker to the unit. Hubbell sent me a new circuit breaker, which I have not installed yet, however, my intuition tells me that the water coming into the system is way too cold for the unit to heat properly. You could have this problem in RI (I live in Oregon). I am waiting to see if the problem continues in the summer before I replace the circuit breakers. Also, when I have company, I try to have everyone stagger their showers. If I had it all to do over again, I probably would just because I don’t want a propane tank on my property and I don’t want to keep water heated all the time. Maybe some day I’ll get all the kinks worked out. Good luck.

  27. I had a SETS unit for a number of years – had the usual problems, not as bad as some had. The only thing good they ever did for me was that when I sent my unit back to exchange for re-built, they sent me the new model, where you set the unit for a temperature in 5 degree increments. This was just before the sale to Hubbell, and I think it is the same unit. It works pretty well, but I have never felt that the unit is economical. I previously had a tank that was heated by my oil fired furnace. When I put in the old SETS, my electric bill doubled. I save on heating oil, because I no longer run the furnace to heat water, but our electric bill is high and I am skeptical that this unit would save money over a conventional electric tank heater. We have it set at 105 degrees, which is the lowest I can get away with without my wife complaining about a “lukewarm” shower. At this temperature I have to mix in cold to get near it, but she uses hot only. Anyway – at that setting any other use of hot water will leave the person showering with (truly) lukewarm water at best. Someone posted earlier about setting one at 125 – I wonder how their bill is. We are now averaging about 900 KWH a month – that’s two adults and one toddler. Dishwasher, electric clothes dryer, but no jaccuzzi, no AC at this time. Does anyone have a real-world comparison of cost between tankless electric and conventional tank? SN

  28. I am interested to see the extensive comments on the Hubbell version of the SETS tankless water heaters. I live in RI and am interesting in replacing my 20+ year old 80 gallon rented electric hot water heater with a tankeless hot water heater. I have a small 2 bathroom condo: both are full baths with tub/shower. 80 gal hot water heater is way oversized, but apparently the only size the electric company would install as a rental heater back in those days. I have been unable to find any one in the area that actually has an ELECTRIC tankless hot water heater: nor have I spoken to any plumbers that have installed one: this has me a little concerned. All the plumbers I have talked to in this area are of the opinion that only a gas tankless would be a good choice, and that is not an option for me. They insist that an electric one would cause all kinds of problems. Instead they are willing to repl my water heater with a 50 gal one. I would like to save the electricity by not heating even 50 gal of hot water when not needed, and (even more important in a small space) I’d like to save the SPACE taken up by ANY hot water heater and use it for more storage: Can anyone in the CT/MA./RI area testify to having sucess with the Hubbell tankless models? If so, are there problems with running water another place in the house when one is taking a shower – or even using two showers at a time? My showers are fitted with low flow shower heads (previously done by electric company in an energy saving offer). While I am the sole occupant of my condo, I would also like to feel that when company is visiting I still have sufficient hot water to serve us all!
    thanks,

  29. All of you that have Hubbell need to be aware that they might a Patent Infrigement problem in the very near future, since they supposedly bought this new technology from the old owner of SETS a Canadian by the name of Jerome Morabito. He sold Hubbell a technology that he supposedly owned but this is to be seen in the near future, so if you are buying a Hubbell you need be aware of this conflict.

  30. All of you that have a Hubbell beware, since the technology that they are using is under a “Patent Pending” and will be a problem for them in the near future, the old owne rof SETS a Canadian by the name of Jerome Morabito sold them the technology hew supposedly owner and this will be a problem , since SETS nor Morabito owned any technology. Hubbel has been advised so they are aware of the potential Patent Infringment that is to come.

  31. HUBBELL has got it completely right. Everything worked perfectly out of the box. NO TEMPERATURE FLUCTUATION at all. Finally a real electric tankless that does as advertised.

  32. Ok, there were a few hiccups to begin with, like I was promised the unit in a week but then after I placed the order it went upto two, but two guys, Sean C and Sam W were pretty responsive, I got the unit just before I went on vacation so I couldn’t install it, but it was a cinch, involving minor pipe cutting. The heater’s computer never worked from the get go but Sam shipped a good one out immediately. But it still didn’t give enough heated h20 so he is shipping another unit out to me today.
    I was very impressed with Sam’s standing by his product and claiming these heaters were his baby and he wanted to get things right. Perfectly understandable when one in many units could malfunction during transit.
    With support like this, I can see these guys going much farther than SETS did. Keep up the good work hubbell folk !
    (The unit didn’t fluctuate during showers though it did during tub baths. But it looks much better built than SETS, although it fits into the older housing)
    Will report in a few days how the heater install went.

  33. CARLOS CABRERA…..Now It all comes together!
    CARLOS CABRERA, ROSA CABRERA his wife and JUNIOR CABRERA were 10 year operating employees of SETS-SYSTEMS. They stole from the owner of the company and the consumers. In 2006 when CARLOS CABRERA believed that SETS new NASA assisted technology for true flow modulation and temperature control was complete, CARLOS CABRERA stole the technology and started his own company called AMERICAN TANKLESS WATER HEATER CORP. CARLOS CABRERA used the stolen SETS units and painted the casings white & promised a LIFETIME WARRANTY.
    To his surprise the STOLEN TECHNOLOGY WAS NOT YET COMPLETE and his new company atwhcorp.com (now defunct) went out of business within the first year…..so much for his lifetime warranty.
    CARLOS CABRERA then went to work for AMERICAN HEAT (americanheatus.com) and proceeded to steal from them and their customers. His deception was discovered within the year and he took off looking for another tankless supporter with money to fleece.
    Now on his 4th company in 2 years CARLOS CABRERA found a convicted felon (public record) to partner a new company. SILVIO CORDOSO http://www.miaminewtimes.com/2001-04-19/news/you-are-cordially-invited/ This is all very interesting because CARLOS CABRERA is again claiming NASA technology that does not belong to him and he also says this company has “manufactured” for 15 years and it is a “MADE IN AMERICA” Eco Green product. They formed their new company called ECOSMART US LLC (ECOSMARTUS.COM) on Dec. 4/08 (see sunbiz.org ecosmart us llc)

    THIS PRODUCT IS 100% MADE IN CHINA not America as CARLOS CABRERA states. He is liar and a thief that CANNOT BE TRUSTED. Don’t let him fleece more people. Send your information to every tankless blog and every STATE ATTORNEY to not allow him to deceive people of your State.

  34. I just found out that SETS owner is back again. After SETS closed he started making the same unit under American tankless with another “lifetime waranty” and that went under after 2 years. I found that his new name is now ecosmart tankless with yet again another lifetime warranty. Can you beleive this

  35. Thanks to this forum and many contributors I revived my confidence that Hubbel will deliver, so I placed my order for a refurb today..will post back on how it goes !

  36. Thanks to this forum and many contributors I revived my confidence that Hubbel will deliver, so I placed my order for a refurb today..will post back on how it goes !

  37. I am a user of Tankless Heaters for over 21 years. I am an eight year satisfied customer of SETS 165 and was disheartened to hear of their demise as well as the demise of my Lifetime Warrantee. I had hoped to replace the unit with the same but am convinced I will go with a Hubbell 180-2. I believe it will be an easy swap.

    I was intrigued to read about American Heat and most of the others, although I had hoped for a more concise site comparing all Electric Tankless Water Heaters.

    The only reason I am going to replace with a Hubbell is due to the discounts. I’ll let you know how I fare.

  38. After much research on the internet, looking mainly at direct specification comparisons, I chose to purchase the Hubbell (formerly SETS) 280-3 tankless system. I installed the unit about three weeks ago. The heater is connected to a recirculation loop which incorporates the Grundfos UP10-16ATLC pump as well as a 40 gallon storage tank. This somewhat ‘hybrid’ system (using a storage tank along with a tankless heater) works well because the recirc pump delivers hot water to the taps within seconds. Additionally, the storage tank ensures that anyone taking a shower is effectively buffered against temperature fluctuations or power cuts. The heater was easy to install and comes with a very user-friendly manual. Initially I had an issue with the way the water temperature would dip dramatically after a tap was opened, and then recover gradually to the set-point temperature. The literature claimed that the unit would provide ‘instant’ hot water. But a call to Chris Zaveruha at Hubbell revealed that my unit (and maybe others) has a ‘ramping’ feature which gradually increases the power to the unit in order to avoid the potentially large electrical drain causing brown-out or flickering of other household electrical systems. This feature makes good sense although I would suggest that Hubbell should advertise this so users are not surprised and/or disappointed when the unit doesn’t seem to function as expected. Recently I rang Hubbell again and spoke with Sam Wellington who, it turned out, was one of the designers of the ramping feature and when I described my situation he offered me a very easy fix which immediately corrected the ‘problem’.

    Personally, although my unit has only been operating for about three weeks, I am pleased by its design and functionality. Some of the small features are what have impressed me the most. Intelligent though has gone into the design. Things like the 16 inch spacing between the mounting holes. Anyone who has done work on a house knows that this is the distance between the studs in the wall, so it makes sense to have your mounts at this spacing. But not one other heater that I looked at shared this simple feature. Furthermore the Hubbell units have ‘Sharkbite’ connectors for the inlet and outlet pipes which are extremely easy to use and mean that the unit can be disconnected from its pipework easily if necessary. The flow meter on the unit is the most sensitive one on any heater I saw, activating at only .25 gpm. Less than half the flow rate of the next best system. This saves water as well as energy. The units are also highly modular so if one component fails it can be replaced without having to return the entire unit.

    In closing I want to say that the customer service has been good. Time will tell how the unit performs, but so far I’m happy with it and with the support I have had from Hubbell.

  39. I replaced my Set 22kW tankless water heater with a Hubbel 21kW. I had my SETS unit for 5 years and experienced similar problems that others reported about the SETS product. I’ve had my Hubble Tankless Water Heater for approximately 1 month and I have been delighted with the performance and the quality of the product.
    The customer representative I contacted was very knowledgeable and very open in his comments about the SETS problems of the past. I would recommend anyone who has any questions to contact Hubbel and ask for Christopher Zaveruha, see his contact information below:
    Hubbell- The Electric Heater Company
    (203) 378-2659 Ext 134
    chrisz@hubbellheaters.com

    Here are my comments:
    1. There is no comparison between the SETS and Hubbel Tankless Water Heater. The Hubbel unit has been completely reengineered to meet the highest industry standards.
    2. So far we have not experienced any temperature fluctuations during showers, even when other hot water appliances are in use.
    3. The new temperature display and adjustment is easy to adjust and the temperature is accurately displayed.
    4. I also received a 15% discount for my old SETS unit, which I was returned back to the factory free of charge.
    5. The new Hubble unit is completely silent. Conversely, not so with SETS, the sound generated during operation was quite an annoyance.

    Satisfied Customer

  40. I replaced my Set 22kW tankless water heater with a Hubbel 21kW. I had my SETS unit for 5 years and experienced similar problems that others reported about the SETS product. I’ve had my Hubble Tankless Water Heater for approximately 1 month and I have been delighted with the performance and the quality of the product.
    The customer representative I contacted was very knowledgeable and very open in his comments about the SETS problems of the past. I would recommend anyone who has any questions to contact Hubbel and ask for Christopher Zaveruha, see his contact information below:
    Hubbell- The Electric Heater Company
    (203) 378-2659 Ext 134
    chrisz@hubbellheaters.com

    Here are my comments:
    1. There is no comparison between the SETS and Hubbel Tankless Water Heater. The Hubbel unit has been completely reengineered to meet the highest industry standards.
    2. So far we have not experienced any temperature fluctuations during showers, even when other hot water appliances are in use.
    3. The new temperature display and adjustment is easy to adjust and the temperature is accurately displayed.
    4. I also received a 15% discount for my old SETS unit, which I was returned back to the factory free of charge.
    5. The new Hubble unit is completely silent. Conversely, not so with SETS, the sound generated during operation was quite an annoyance.

    Satisfied Customer

  41. I replace my Set 22kW tankless water heater with a Hubbel 21kW. I had my SETS unit for 5 years and experience similar problems that others reported about the SETS product. I’ve had my Hubble Tankless Water Heater for approximately 1 month and I have been delighted with the performance and the quality of the product. To keep is short here are my following comments.
    The customer representative I contacted was very knowledgeable and very open in his comments the SETS problems of the past. I would recommend any who has any questions to contact Hubbel and ask for Christopher Zaveruha, see his contact below:
    Hubbell- The Electric Heater Company
    (203) 378-2659 Ext 134
    chrisz@hubbellheaters.com
    Here are my comments:
    1. There is no comparison between the SETS and Hubbel Tankless Water Heater. The Hubbel unit has been completely reengineered to meet the highest industry standards.
    2. So far we have no experience any temperature fluctuations during showers, even when others when other hot water appliances are in use.
    3. The new temperature display and adjustment is easy to adjust and the temperature is accurately displayed.
    4. I also receive a 15% discount for my old SETS unit, which I which I was required to return back to the factory free of charge.
    5. The new Hubble unit is complete silent. Conversely, no so with SETS, the sound generated during operation was quite an annoyance.
    Satisfied Customer

  42. I purchased a SETS Model 240 for new construction in 2006. It sort of “blew up” when there was not enough water pressure to keep the water flowing. We installed a pressure pump (as three are no pumps in the city system and my house is on a hill where there is little water pressure) and replaced all of the heating elements, thermostats,etc. after dealing with customer service at SETS for three months (during which time I had no hot water). After about a year and a half, the flex pipe burst and flooded my bedroom, where the unit is located (in the closet). We replaced the flex and about two more months passed and the pipe burst again and flooded the bedroom again. The flex people said that the heater got too hot and suspected that the flow valve had malfunctioned, causing the temperature to be too high. So, I got in touch with SETS again and discovered that SETS had been bought out by HUBBELL. Because my home was not plumbed for a standard water heater, and I was assured by Chris Z. at HUBBELL that the SETS units had been completely rebuilt and improved, I decided to purchase a new unit rather than put “new wine into old skins”. The new unit arrived one week later and my builder installed it. Upon examination of the two units, it was obvious that the new units had been improved. The old SETS unit looked like it had been built out of Star Wars space junk. The new one was very professionally constructed. It has a digital temperature readout and a visible blinking light which stops blinking to indicate when the unit has turned off. We also installed a pressure relief valve for added safety. Now I feel comfortable leaving home without turning off the main water valve and the electricity to the unit. I have waited three months to write these comments, just to be sure the new unit is performing well as Chris at HUBBELL said it would. I am very satisfied with the new unit and with the customer service at HUBBELL. As someone wrote in another blog, “It is hard to go green.” New technology is difficult to embrace, and plumbers are sometimes resistant to learning new technology when it worked the old way, why change it? I am a happy “green” person,now, but it wasn’t an easy road.

  43. Jeremy:

    One of the service people at Hubbell said exactly that: The old SETS owner is reportedly starting up another company, and that indeed stinks on ice. It’s terrible that such things can be done.

    That said, when one company (Hubbell) purchases another company (SETS) it’s not uncommon at all for the new owner to purchase the assets only and not the liabilities (crappy products out there under lifetime warranties). Who in their right mind would buy the liabilities from SETS, given the poor performance of their products?

    I don’t think you can lump Hubbell into the same group as SETS, unless you’re suggesting that Hubbell is the ‘new company’ that you mentioned. If that’s what you’re inferring, Hubbell has been in business for a long time… 40+ yrs I believe. A friend of mine used to sell industrial eqpt & had them for a customer. He had nothing but positive things to say about them. In other words, I researched them before I jumped in bed with them.

    Could I get stuck by them as well? I guess so. All I know is that they’ve backed up everything that they promised me so far. That’s about all you can ask for, in my humble opinion. Believe me, I’m as p#$$ed off about SETS as anyone but I can’t re-direct my displeasure at Hubbell because I got duped out of a ‘lifetime warranty’ from SETS. Apparently it meant SETS’s lifetime, not the lifetime of the water heater! 🙁

  44. There seems to be plenty of negative comments about the SETS Systems so I won’t bore you with mine here. I’ve owned two 240 units and neither worked right from the start. Since I bought both units secondhand, I was able to sell both for double what I paid for them. I, in turn, bought a Steibel Eltron based on recommendations from a gentleman that has one. Want to talk about FLAWLESS operation? These are made in Germany, where tankless water heaters are not new technology. Should there have been “kinks” in the system, they’ve been ironed out long ago. I bought mine on Ebay for about $600 w/free shipping. I did the install myself and noticed immediately that the copper cylinders shown inside of the SETS unit (for heating the water) are about half the size as those on the Steibel Eltron. I did have to increase the gauge of wire going to the box but this was simple to route from the junction box close by. We’ve had constant hot water from the day it was powered up. We’ve owned ours for about a year now and still, it does one heck of a job.

    Those of you bargaining with the idea of continuing business with the company that “took over” SETS, I submit the old cliche’: “Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.” For a company to shut it’s doors or sell out as SETS supposedly did, how hard do you think it would be for that same person to open ANOTHER company under a different name and still operate the same business? This way, the Lifetime Warranty no longer has to be honored and ALL those problem units out there won’t have to be fixed on the company’s dime. Their reputation is already tarnished so for what reason would there be to continue operating under that name? Why is it you’re getting offers from another company to give them money to honor a lifetime warranty you already paid for?

    Just my $.02. I’m glad I don’t have to deal with that SETS piece of s@*t anymore.

    1. Hi Jeremy; I just finished reading your email. I was just about ready to buy the Stiebel, when I found the Hubbell. They both look like they function simialar (Hubbell 28-3 vs Stiebel 29). I am wondering about the activation flow rate on the Stiebel being .87 gpm. Has that been a problem with any of your faucets? I like the idea of Stiebel because they’ve been in the game for so long in Germany, but I also like the idea of Hubbell being a US company (I rep. some of their Industrial Electronic products-seem to be high quality items). Any info or opinion you can provide me will be greatly appreciated.
      Thanks-Mark

  45. So long SETS. Hello Hubbell. Finished the install on Sunday. I tried the two 50 amp double pole breakers. They tripped out. Went with the 100 amp double and all works fine. Nice hot shower and the dishwasher even ran at the same time. WOW. Thanks to Hubbell for making my life easier.

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